Putting My Money Where My Mouth Is!

Stories!

9 minute read

February 12, 2024

Whatever happened to the hype man?

I mean, I know that some occupations unfortunately go out of style.

still use a travel agent, by the way.  So don’t add that one to the list.

But while the telegraphist, pinsetter, elevator operator, and town crier may have gone the way of the dodo bird, I think there’s always going to be a place for the hype man.

On the subject of hype men, there need be no debate for the greatest ever.

While some recent commenters here on Toronto Realty Blog might suggest that, whether it need to directly pertain to real estate, or not, it might be me who is the greatest hype man of all time.

After all, I’ve been “hyping” the market, right?  In the face of poor real estate statistics and all, I continue to be bullish about the market.

Flattering as that honour may be, I lack the necessary clock to be the greatest hype man of all time.

Picture it.  You know who I’m talking about.

Maybe my shoulders aren’t broad enough to carry a clock as big as he did back in the day, I think few could ever compare to the GOAT.

The image is legendary:

Flavor Flav is almost a senior citizen.

I can’t believe it.

In March, he will turn sixty-five years old, but I’m sure he could still hype up a crowd like it’s 1985.

My attempts to hype the Toronto real estate market simply can’t hold a candle to what Flav did with Chuck D and Public Enemy in the 1980’s, but that’s okay.  I know my place.

Having said that, I’ve been saving this blog post for a while now.  I wanted to to wait until the transaction had closed, but I also figured I’d wait until there was a gap in the goings-on of the Torotno real estate market and that I wouldn’t be taking a blog post away from a hot listing or in-the-trenches story.

I can be somewhat……….impulsive, if I’m being honest.

I’m not the one to purchase the goods next to the cash register at Canadian Tire or Sobey’s, but I can be prone to making snap decisions.

It doesn’t necessary mean they’re not well thought out decisions, but I can act quickly.

I was in the office on Tuesday, January 2nd.

It was the first day “back” at work, although our office was virtually empty.

My family and I had just returned from London, England, the day before, as we had the pleasure of visiting my brother and his family for five incredible days.  The only time that I really, truly ever disconnect is when I’m in London.  Going on a “vacation” Punta Cana or West Palm Beach doesn’t take me away from Toronto and the real estate market, sadly, or expectedly.  But going to London does.  Maybe it’s the time change or maybe it’s the company I keep, I don’t know.  But when I got back on January 2nd, I was rested and ready to take on the world.

There was one problem with that, however: the real estate market was still on Winter Break.

While I can always “find things to do” in my line of work, whether it’s writing blogs, filming videos, touching base with clients, etc., there isn’t really much real estate to list and sell on the second day of January.

That first week of January was quite slow.

I received few inquiries from new would-be buyers, two of which were investors.

I told both of them, “There isn’t really anything on the market right now that I love.  Most of what’s available are holdovers from last year and re-lists from last year.  In lieu of a massive change in price, none of these are worth looking at.”

I’m very choosey when it comes to investment condos.

The price is important, of course.  But the location is important too.  So is the actual building in which the unit is located.  And the style.  And the layout.  And the size.

I don’t love “micro condos” but I don’t like 1-plus-den condos either.

I like small, 1-bedroom condos.  They have the highest yield, and a 1-bed-plus-den, 2-bath, is just too small for the tenant who wants a 2-bed, 2-bath, but way too large for the tenant who’s looking for a 1-bedroom.

I like buildings with low maintenance fees.  Who doesn’t?

But that means I like buildings with few amenities.  It’s great if your investment condo is in a building with a gym, pool, concierge, etc., as your tenants will love that!  But also consider that a low-amenity building comes with low fees.

Who doesn’t like a building where utilities are included in the maintenance fees too, right?

There’s a lot that goes into choosing an investment property, but as I said at the onset, price and location are usually atop the list.

About one week into January, I saw a unit hit MLS that looked familiar.

I mean, everything was familiar except the price.

I clicked on the listing, then the listing history, and I said, “Ah, okay, I know this unit.”

The property had been listed for sale last year for $599,900.

Then it was up for $589,900.

Then $574,900.

Then finally $555,000, where it sat for the rest of the year.

But now it was suddenly listed for $494,900 and it seemed, how we say, too good to be true.

This wasn’t a huge unit, by the way.  It was only 495 square feet, albeit with a huge balcony, and a soft-loft, open concept style.  But there’s an argument to be made that $1,000 per square foot isn’t really a “deal.”

Except that if you look at the history of the market and of this unit, you can also make an argument that it was, in fact the very definition of a “deal.”

Which of the following is the most powerful?

1) The unit was listed for $599,900 and was now listed for $494,900.

2) The unit was purchased for $515,000 in January of 2019 and was now on the market in January of 2024 for $494,900.

3) The unit was listed for $1,000/sqft but the prevailing average in the building, over the last 365 days, is $1,210/sqft.

4) The same model sold for $618,800 at the “peak” in 2022.

Those are all pretty good reasons to think that $494,900 was, in fact, a “deal,” but if you had to pick one, which would it be?

In any event, the reason I say to “pick one” is because I feel that one of those reasons is sufficient to represent a deal, but all four together provide irrefuteable evidence that this is a deal.

So I emailed an investor-client of mine and told him about the property.

I didn’t want to sound like a hype man here, but I told him, “This won’t last.”

Geez.

Neither will that used car that’s been sitting on the dealership lot for weeks, right?

I called one of the new buyers who had reached out to me days prior and told him about the unit as well.  He said, “It’s just too fast for me, but I appreciate you touching base.”

Then I called the other would-be investor and told her about the unit as well, and she said she would mull it over and get back to me.

Sidebar here, and we’ll get back to where we just left off, I promise…

In February of 2005, I sold my brother and his fiancée a condo at 168 King Street East.

Two weeks later, an awesome unit was listed for sale at 230 King Street East that was very similar to the one my brother had bought, as both had huge outdoor terraces, but it was smaller in size and probably better suited for one person.

I called my buddy Pete and said, “Hey, you said you want to get a place this spring, so let’s go check out this unit.”

So we did.

I distinctly remember walking through the unit and falling in love with it immediately.

But my love was much, much greater than Pete’sas he just wasn’t the smitten kitten.

He said, “Um, I dunno.”

And I replied, “Are you sure?”

Pete said, “Yeah, I just, I dunno.  The timing, and all.”

So I told Pete, “Look man, honestly, truly, if you don’t buy this unit, I will.”

He threw his head back and laughed.  How could he not?  It’s old-school sales bullshit, right?

I said, “Pete, honestly, I’m telling you right now; almost asking you.  If you’re not going to buy this place, no problem, seriously.  But I’m going to.  Okay?”

He said, “Alright.”

And two days later, I bought the unit.

I lived one block from my brother (not sure if his fiancée was a fan of the move…) for the next five years and we both came of age in our young adulthood in the King East area.

But that’s an aside.

The point is that there have been times in my life where I’ve said, “If you don’t buy this, I will,” and have meant it.

When it came to this little condo, listed for $494,900, that all of my investors were passing on, I felt the same way.

Real estate as an investment is very, very different from a share of stock.

A share of stock can go down to $0.

A house or condo can’t.

A piece of real estate doesn’t pay dividends like a stock does, but over time, I think we can all agree that the price goes up no matter what.

I had no doubt that this condo, which was “worth” over $600,000 in 2022, would attain that value again.

I simply couldn’t let go of the fact that this wasn’t just a deal, it was a steal, and I obsessed about it that night.

The next morning, I called the listing agent and said, “So you’re at $494,900, eh?”

She said, “Yeah,” with a bit of a sigh.

I said, “And you were at $555,000 in December.”

She said, “Yessir,” with a bit more enthusiasm.

I said, “So is this $494,900, but we’re kinda, sorta, hoping that we get multiple offers, and push the price up by twenty, thirty, forty grand?”

She was all business and replied, “No, David.  They need to sell.”

I answered, “So, if I bring you an offer for $494,900 right now, no conditions, three-week closing, with a $50,000 bank draft, you’re good to go?”

Agents like this know how to get deals done.  It was clear that her clients wanted to sell, so she was taking their lead and acting accordingly.

“Look, these guys are giving this away, okay?  But we’re not going to mess around.  Not a penny under the list price, seriously, not a penny.  I’ve got an offer in hand from somebody who came in last night with a bullshit offer and the sellers just want this done, okay?”

Okay.  Understood.

So call it impulsive if you want to, but I decided to put my money where my mouth was.

I was bullish on the market.

Bullish short, medium, and long-term, and this was a downright steal.

So I made an offer.

And three hours later, it was accepted.

I paid $494,900 for the unit, but if we’re being completely honest here, when you reduce the purchase price by the real estate commission plus HST, the price ends up being $480,920.

So since I know most of you want the numbers, let’s work with that.

The down payment is 20%.

That’s $96,184.

Interest rates suck, right?

But this is a long-term play, just as every investment condo should be.

I took a variable rate at a whopping 6.7%.

That’s big!  I know.

But that’s for today.  And for tomorrow.  It’s not forever, and while I understand that all investments “need a return,” I choose not to evaluate my return (or loss!) based on the next few months, but rather the next five years at a minimum, but realistically over twenty.

The monthly mortgage payment is $2,459.27, via the 30-year amortization.

The maintenance fees for the unit at $305.58 per month.

The taxes are $183.33 per month.

The tenant will pay the utilities.

This unit “should” rent for $2,400 per month, becasue of the location and the building, but the rental market is flooded right now and it’s soft.  So let’s say $2,300.

All in, this unit costs $2,948.18 per month and I’ll only get $2,300.

Gosh.

I’m losing $648.18 per month!

But that’s cash flow and I have cash on hand.

There’s $350 per month of principal repayment, so the condo is “only” losing $298.18 per month.

Still a terrible investment from the perspective of many out there, right?

But what’s $298.18 per month?

$3,600 per year?

Who cares?

At some point in the next 12-24 months, we will see a five-year, fixed rate of 3.49%.

That’s my target.

I’m not greedy.  I’m not looking for the pandemic-driven 1.69% rates or even the 2.69% rate I have on my principal residence.

Just a simple 3.49% rate.

When that happens, the numbers change.

The mortgage is $1,720.11 per month.

The monthly carry is $2,209.02.

The unit will still rent for $2,300, or more, if this is in 1-2 years.

So the unit is cash-flow positive by $100-$200 per month, but as I said, I’m not concerned with cash flow.

Of the new $1,720.11/month payment, now $650/month is principal repayment.

So we’re about $750 – $850 per month in the black.

Yes, there are going to be expenses, such as the real estate fee to find a new tenant, or upkeep on the unit.

But $10,000+ per year on the $96,184 down payment + $12,187 sunk cost in land transfer tax + $3,000 in legal fees and disbursements is a 9% return.

And that doesn’t include appreciation.

Real estate investing has always benefitted from leverage.

While a cynic or a bear will point out, “Five-times leverage can be five times as painful when you take a loss,” I have made it clear that I don’t believe in a loss here.  I’m not selling this unit and over 5, 10, or 20 years, this will go up.

Let’s say that the condo market “only” appreciated 2.5%, on average, every year, for the next ten years.

25% in a decade?

Does anybody expect less than that?  Tell me if you do, but inflation alone will push prices that high, or more.

So when a real estate investor makes a 20% down payment, they are 5X leveraged.

That 2.5% appreciation is actually a 12.5% return on investment.

Add in the 9% return via cash flow and principal repayment, and this is a 21.5% investment over the next ten years.

That’s with an appreciation rate at the rate of inflation, by the way.

Give me the 50% increase that I think is the minimum over the next decade, and the return is 34% per year.

A good private equity vehicle, for those who have access, and who can lock money up for 5-8 years, should return – what – maybe 15-18%?

Debate that, please and thanks.

Although we’re now risking delving into the dirty world of unverified and anonymous accounts of market returns, which is something I learned not to do while sitting at an East Side Mario’s with my buddies in my early-20’s, but I have no problem putting my facts and figures in the preceding paragraph.

After all, I feel as though I need to live up to the hype.

I’ve put my money where my mouth is.

I’m not here on TRB cheerleading, spinning, or hyping.

Just chatting.  Or rapping.

Please share your thoughts…

…if you have the time…

Written By David Fleming

David Fleming is the author of Toronto Realty Blog, founded in 2007. He combined his passion for writing and real estate to create a space for honest information and two-way communication in a complex and dynamic market. David is a licensed Broker and the Broker of Record for Bosley – Toronto Realty Group

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23 Comments

  1. PE Reader

    at 7:57 am

    Long time PE reader:

    You comparing a direct, levered, real estate investment that is completely subjective to market risks to underwrite your return VS a pooled, diversified private equity fund investment where a GP can operationally change a business is laughable at best.

    That said, doesn’t sound like a bad deal.

    to a pooled, diversified private equity fund investment is laughable at best.

  2. Marina

    at 9:52 am

    Ah, Flavor Flave! Total sidebar here, but “Flavor of Love” is still one of the greatest things I have ever seen – a show so profoundly absurd on every level that it never fails to cheer me up. It’s like if Real Housewives and Jersey Shore had a baby that was way into clocks.

    Regardless of how the market goes in the next couple of years, yeah you will make money on this, no doubt. If you are stable enough financially that the short term doesn’t bother you, then it’s almost inevitable. Congratulations!

  3. Jeremy

    at 10:01 am

    Bravo, David!

    I can’t think of a better comeback to the haters.

  4. cyber

    at 10:30 am

    How come there’s no accounting for income tax on rental income? Principal is not a deductible expense, and you’re in a top income tax bracket?

    1. Anwar

      at 11:31 am

      There’s tax on all investment returns. Different rates for different investments but it’s not like the capital gain on a private equity vehicle is tax-free.

      I knew this post would become a pile-on for David, and I’ll admit that I noticed there’s no accounting for property insurance in his data above but a policy for a condo this size and price is likely $25 per month so it’s nominal. But I thought we would see three days’ worth of holes poked in his investment analysis so here we go.

  5. Vancouver Keith

    at 1:24 pm

    You’re missing $8000 per year in opportunity costs on the capital needed for down payment, property transfer and legal fees that you could safely earn in a balanced and diversified portfolio, but this is a good example of how growing wealth comes from leverage.

    For the average person, learning how to use leverage successfully in the real estate market is a lot easier than learning how to become a successful diy investor in financial markets. Thanks for sharing a real world example of how real estate investing works, and the power of leverage in real estate which is so poorly understood by most people.

  6. Adrian

    at 1:54 pm

    That’s a good buy! The reason some people don’t invest (in whatever) is they’re waiting for conditions to be perfect. But if interest rates and vacancy were at all time lows you’d be paying all time highs! Better to lock in a good price now if you have a long term bullish view.

  7. Vancouver Keith

    at 1:56 pm

    Let’s try the stock market. You have the same $100,000, and you borrow another $100,000 at 6% average cost over 20 years, to pick a cost for the money. You buy a diversified portfolio of Canadian blue chip stocks, currently paying a dividend of around 6%. You set up an online non registered stock investment account, paying almost nothing in commissions and costs over time.

    You decide to pay the $500 per month financing cost on the borrowed money for the full twenty years, in order to take advantage of the commission free dividend reinvestment program offered by most blue chip companies. With dividends reinvested, your return averages 10%.

    After 21.6 years, you have a stock portfolio valued at $1.6 million producing highly tax advantaged dividend income of $96,000 per year assuming a constant 6% dividend rate and you carry the original debt of $100,000. The tax on dividends over the years is offset to some degree by the deductibility of the interest cost on the borrowed $100,000. No assessments for a new roof, no tenant marketing costs, no wear and tear and home maintenance costs, no calls about a blocked toilet at 10 p.m. Much less hassle.

    That’s blue chip stocks, which are just as low risk as real estate, and 10% with dividends reinvested is a very conservative long term return. Some companies increase dividends at well over the inflation rate over time, your mileage will vary.

    1. Eddie

      at 6:54 am

      I personally prefer to invest in stocks rather than an investment property, mainly because my knowledge of real estate is quite a bit less than Dave’s. That being said, I find a 10% return on investment in stocks over the long term to be VERY optimistic.

      1. Appraiser

        at 8:30 am

        Stocks are great. You just can’t live inside them or rent them out.

        Investing is not always an either / or choice.

      2. Vancouver Keith

        at 12:42 pm

        In my example, it’s a strategy of reinvesting all the dividends paid. Most long term averages of the market are in the 7% range, but that is the entire market. That would include stocks that don’t pay dividends, or modest amounts.

        In my TFSA, I’ve owned Royal Bank for a decade with reinvested dividends (which compound away merrily). Canadians banks are in a relatively rare pullback right now because of the sharp increase in interest rates, and my return on Royal is 9.9%. Some people cherry pick the timing on a dividend reinvestment strategy, using the example of a blue chip bought in the trough of a recession, through to an overbought market and come up with numbers like 12% or more.

        Dividends over time might be 4 – 6% per year, capital appreciation might be 3 – 4% per year, but it’s the dividend reinvestment strategy that so few people understand or use that provides the edge over time in this example.

        1. Kramer

          at 1:26 pm

          While I am currently invested in stocks that retain and reinvest their earnings and compound (more tax friendly on ownership), I too am planning my pre-retirement/retirement dividend basket. I will want the 6-8% dividends reinvested through DRIP for 5-years to significantly boost the total number of shares I own that will be earning me retirement money. I will also want those dividends increased by the companies annually over that 5-years. This will ultimately produce my targeted dividend retirement income. The best thing about this is that you can spread the risk (thereby reducing the risk) across 10 dividend payers very easily with minimal transaction costs. Want it to be 15 dividend payers, no problem, cut that risk even more with minimal transaction costs. You can choose mature dividend payers with scale and competitive advantages and keep your eye on their fundamentals to make sure the companies you own are performing well.
          One thing no one talks about in these conversations a classic Buffett/Munger philosophy… stay in your circle of competence. If real estate investment is your strong suit, go for it. If not, make sure it you educate yourself thoroughly. If you don’t understand the stock market and dividend investment strategy, see a financial advisor. In every case know your investment objectives and speak to lots of people and learn as much as possible before putting your hard earned money to work.

        2. Eddie

          at 6:30 am

          Dividend reinvestment is hardly rocket science, I think most of us have a good handle on it. But if we want to do an apples-to-apples comparison of stock returns to real estate investment returns, and you are assuming dividends are reinvested, you would also have to assume net returns on real estate investments are also reinvested in real estate. How common is that?

  8. EastYorker

    at 5:28 pm

    You lost me after “I can always “find things to do” in my line of work, “filming videos”, ”

    What film stock do you use, who processes it ?

    1. Appraiser

      at 8:34 am

      Ooh! what a burn.

      Thanks for your contribution to the germane aspects of the conversation.

  9. Different David

    at 9:40 pm

    I think the biggest miss is that David assumes that his tenants pay the rent. One bad tenant and he’s out thousands of dollars.

    Compared to the other investment, where if RBC, Scotiabank, or CP Rail decide to stop paying dividends – not very likely.

    Throw in a special assessment just for fun, and suddenly the capital gain is now a capital loss for the next 5 years.

    If you have 20 rental units across many different buildings in Toronto, Waterloo, York Region, and SW Ontario, your portfolio suddenly becomes more diversified and able to withstand a poor showing at one unit.

    Of course, I’m calling out worst case scenarios…if everything goes to plan (paying renters, no major expenses, interest rates decline, no more Chow tax rate hikes) then this investment looks like a gem.

  10. Sirgruper

    at 12:31 am

    Congrats David.

    Stocks, private equity, mortgages, commercial real estate are all other great possible investments but David is sticking to what he knows best, residential Toronto real estate. He is knowledgeable and is playing to his strengths. Always a great idea. GL.

    I’ll bet he does well and can sleep at night with his investment.

    1. Kramer

      at 1:30 pm

      Hear hear… he is in his circle of competence… always massively important when you’re ‘running your own money”.

  11. Appraiser

    at 8:26 am

    An excellent long term investment choice. Bravo!

  12. RE Investor

    at 1:25 pm

    Missing insurance (~$400 / year), repair reserves (2.5 – 5.0% of gross rent), vacancy costs (4.0% of gross rent) in here. Also, interest rates dropping by 2.5% – 3.0% might happen in 2-3 years from now making short-term cash flow projections challenging. Just other factors to take into your cash flow forecast.

    Real upside here would be appreciating property values to rebound 2.0 – 3.0% / year conservatively which could happen considering how much construction costs have risen for new-builds.

  13. Libertarian

    at 11:00 am

    David, I know I’m late to this, but congrats on the investment.

    I remember you mentioning during the early days of COVID that you didn’t have any investment properties, but were going to purchase one because interest rates went to zero. So is this the first property you bought? Or have you become a land baron now? haha!

    But let’s be honest, this condo is going to your kids when the time is right, so you’re not going to get any of the profits. Your kids are lucky!

    Personally, I own my home, but all my investment dollars are in equities. As others have written here, equities are a lot simpler to me than dealing with everything that comes with real estate.

  14. Looking Up

    at 7:39 am

    Thanks for the article Dave!

    Loved the insight into cash flow.

    Very informative.

  15. Ace Goodheart

    at 8:34 pm

    I don’t purchase anything that doesn’t come with dirt that I own.

    If PP gets elected, Trump wins and the mid east blows up, are you still expecting a return to low single digit rates? When there is no more borrowed socialist money flooding around making everyone want to spend big?

    People don’t know what’s about to happen because no one was alive the last time it did.

    Folks in their advanced years, like me, can see it.

    But is it better to see the train before it hits you, or to just get hit? Isn’t watching it coming more painful?

Pick5 is a weekly series comparing and analyzing five residential properties based on price, style, location, and neighbourhood.

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